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In times of financial hardship, meditators are still willing to pay large fees to hear the teachings of high-profile Buddhists

Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje attracted 2,000 people, paying $200 each, to hear him speak at an event. Photograph: Lobsang Wangyal/EPA

Here we are stuck in an economic downturn, with the threat of afinancial tsunami gathering momentum in the eurozone and with pundits telling us it can only get worse. You might expect people to be careful about their budget priorities and that nonessential expenditure like spiritual teachings would be put on hold.

Evidence suggests, however, that the opposite is true especially if you happen to be Buddhist. It seems that in this period of acute financial stress, Buddhists are still willing to part with their pounds, dollars, roubles and rupees in order to sustain their meditation practice. Because meditation calms the mind and generates insight, this is a predictable response but what does come as a surprise is the amounts of money involved.

Take the17th Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje, for example. A young, high-profile Tibetan Buddhist with a romantic history of escape from Tibet after dodging Chinese security. Confined for several years under conditions resembling house arrest in India, he eventually managed to visit the United States for the first time in 2008. About 2,000 people gathered at a monastery in Woodstock to catch a glimpse of him. They paid $200 each. Roughly $400,000 (250,000) hit the coffers and after expenses, the monastery had enough left over to embark on an extensive building project.

Then theresSogyal Rinpoche credited as author of the bestsellerThe Tibetan Book of Living and Dying. A recent feature in the French news magazineMarianne revealed that the cheapest tariff for a weeks teachings with him at his centre Lerab Ling in France was €500 (425) which entitled participants to pitch a tent and eat vegetarian food. Five hundred people attended the retreat, including reporter Elodie Emery which means that Sogyal attracted more than €250,000 on one occasion.

Emery estimates that Lerab Ling pulls in €1m to €1.5m annually in retreat fees alone in addition to shop sales and donations. Sogyals global organisation, Rigpa,rift warlock. has websites that include multiple income streams. One of them, the Tertön Sogyal foundation, targets will bequests. Board members include Pedro Beroy, the managing director of the investment banking division of Credit Suisse.

In October this year, 1,500 people flew to Tenerife for three days of teachings withChoegyal Namkhai Norbu, one of the few remaining Tibetan s still active who was trained in pre-Chinese Tibet. A widely respected master of the Dzogchen tradition of Tibetan Buddhism, Namkhai Norbu attracts capacity audiences wherever he goes. In Tenerife the cost was €150, excluding flights, accommodation and subsistence.

In common with pop musicians – 5:55 am, footballers and corporate CEOs, it is the superstar Buddhist teachers who generate big money. Without them, many centres around the world would be hard pressed to make ends meet. As the older ones fade away, a new generation including the 17th Karmapa, is being groomed to take their place. These include the reincarnations of the late Ling Rinpoche, Kalu Rinpoche and Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche. (Rinpoche means precious one).

But if all this sounds like quality Buddhist teachings are beyond the reach of middle- to low-income neophytes there is good news. In the UK, several Buddhist organisations offer meditation instruction at moderate prices. TheDechen community led by Lama Jampa Thaye offers one-day courses for 17.50, rising to 20 next year. A two- or three-day event with the high-profile Sakya Trizin costs 20-25 per day. Beginners classes are around 4 per session.

Gaia House in Devon has a programme of residential courses with visiting teachers, with cost on a sliding scale from 118 to 59 depending on means. Director Andy Power says theres an element of trust involved in this. The fees for a Zen retreat with senior teachers Stephen and Martine Batchelor range from 363 to 76.

TheTheravada Buddhist organisation,The Samatha Trust, relies on voluntary donations for teachings and retreats. The exception to this, says the treasurer, Anne Schellizi, is that we charge beginners a flat 50 for a weekend at our centre.

When the Thai meditation master Nai Boonman visits, world of warcraft easy gold Anne says retreatants are spontaneously generous. The trust covers its overheads on an annual income of 35,000 Lava Flow Mi, but runs appeals for projects like new buildings.

An Indian prince, 2,500 years ago, brought up in the lap of luxury renounced all worldly possessions to become the Buddha. His example led to the foundation of an order of mendicant monks and nuns who rely on the generosity of local communities for their survival.

The basis of monasteries is not economic production, saysRupert Gethin, professor of Buddhist studies at Bristol University, but theres a form of social contract if you want monks and nuns in your society you have to support them. Monastic institutions can accept financial donations and some of them do become quite wealthy.

Clearly many organisations are making healthy profits from running Buddhist events, although it is a recognised principle that the teachings are not for sale. Whether this state of affairs is corrupt or simply a 21st century fact of life is open to debate.

A person inclined to a religion, including Buddhism, is fairly irrational to begin with and, thus, less inclined to cut non-essentials from tightening budgets.

Evidence suggests, however, that the opposite is true especially if you happen to be Buddhist. It seems that in this period of acute financial stress, Buddhists are still willing to part with their pounds, dollars, roubles and rupees in order to sustain their meditation practice.

Or maybe, in the West, Buddhists mainly come from the affluent classes, and can therefore still afford these things even in times of recession.

But never mind, I dont get the point of this article at all. Is it a plug for Buddhist organisations? Is it saying that people turn to religion during difficult times? Or that, in a flourishing market economy Vindictus Pu, Buddhism, like anything else, is available in both economy class and first class versions?

A person inclined to a religion, including Buddhism, is fairly irrational to begin with and, thus, less inclined to cut non-essentials from tightening budgets.

If, after examining the available evidence, you believe that something is true then it is rational to accept and act upon that belief, this is true for religious believers, atheists, political activists and all other kinds of people.

The only reason you believe that acceptance of religion is not a rational reaction for many people is that you do not share this belief yourself.

Therefore your comment is wrong.

I just use youtube.

Look at all the Jeff Foster ( videos on you tube for example – for the price of zero pence you can watch and listen as Jeff talks.

And hes just one dude – there are thousands on youtube, all free.

Buddhism isnt really a religion in any sort of monotheist sense of the word. You might even consider it a philosophy, but people will argue about that.

The Buddha actually existed in historical record, and made it clear to anyone whod listen that he wasnt a God.

However its true that a lot of people peddle shit that is based on Buddhism. Most New Age warbling amounts to little more than aspects of Buddhism turned into belief systems all on their own. Without the basis they came from theyre all isolated and meaningless to varying degrees.

Personally, Buddhism stands alone, and bears little comparison to other recognized modern religions.

So, the Buddhists are just after our money (I am certain there is a saying about a fool and money), andtheir leaders are accused of sexual abuse, which is covered up by a culture of silence. Nice to see that it is not just the Catholics doing this type of stuff.

This money spinning lark sounds like Billy Graham for vegetarians. Theyll be offering degrees next.

Ive known a few Buddhist monks, and they seemed to me to lead a wholly parasitic and manipulative existence. Just because a religion is from the east doesnt make it wise.

Nothing new about the guru racket — or passing round the collection plate.

But forgive me if Im wrong, havent these renunciate bhikkhus taken a precept never to handle money?

Theres a Buddhist centre in the city near me. They do a reasonable vegetarian organic cafe and their meditation hall is open to anyone. They also do lunchtime and evening meditation classes that they charge a modest amount for. All well and good.

The only thing that put me off was the wall display expounding the teacher and his works, and the various important people he has met. The same theme was carried over into the various leaflets too. Perhaps I misunderstand Buddhism wow gold cheap , but I thought such adulation was inappropriate (but very human) and something that the original Buddha tried to avoid.

I am a practising catholic… but I always temper any religious belief or practice with what my mum used to say… that basically she didnt want to get involved in organised religion or spirituality as people tended to corrupt the initial inspiration or idea. Ive been around the block enough to know that this is very true – whatever your culture, religion, practice etc…

Interestingly – John Henry Newman (beatified last year by the Pope in England) apparently once said that the church shouldnt worry too much about attacks from the outside.. but from the problems from within.. seems like sound advice.

People taint religion and religion in its basic form has always been about people trying to understand what its all about and get in touch with reality (whatever that may be). This articule just confirms that religion is willing to charge and people are still looking.

I have to say though that if you want a quiet moment, if you want to meditate or listen to someone elses words,, going to church (whether for a religious service or just to sit and be quite when noone else is around) is still free for all – despite its drawbacks! lol.

@KenBarlow

These nondualists, or Neo-Advaitaists,Updates 1. have to be the most irritating group of pseuds to recently appear within the spiritual marketplace since western middle-class Buddhists. Long profound pauses between sentences….No Ones there…Youre not real. Blah-de-blah. Thatll be 15 please.

Also, why do they always hold their non-meetings in and around Hampstead? Hold one in Peckham, or Tottenham, and see if the message still sounds appealing…

Buddism is just a religion for people who dont want to be seen as religious but rather as-(puke-puke)- spiritual.

Yes, but believers of a certain Angry Sky Bully always think people who believe in a different Angry Sky Bully are wrong/cultists/evil/mad/stupid, while people who believe in the same Angry Sky Bully as themselves are somehow special/different and not wrong/cultists/evil/mad/stupid. For example, look at all the attacks on Mormons for their crazy beliefs, from people who themselves think some pretty mad stuff.

So how is Buddhism so different from other religions then?

This is vaguely true of Buddhism in general, but its particularly true of Tibetan Buddhism. The astute men in red may be the most spectacularly successful refugees in history.

No- ones forced to buy into the teaching. If people pay, its because they want to, not because they have to. Thats truly what money is for.

Considering that distress and unhappiness are really damaging to ones health thus earning potential, this could be for many money very well- spent.

At least Buddhists dont stand on street corners yelling at us about how evil we are, like some people of faith.

How many predominantly Buddhist nations are democracies with half-decent human-rights records?

Despite its current hipness Buddhism is just another peasant mentality and vehicle for religious charlatans trying to a make a few quid off the gullible. We need less religion in the world, not more.

In my opinion, Buddhist teaching often fails properly to distinguish proximate (likely) and remote (unlikely) causes. There certainly is an element of mumbo- jumbo in imagining that ones life condition here and now might be primarily a result of bad karma accrued in the distant past, or even a hypothetical previous existence.

So thats why the medical profession increasingly recommends Buddhist techniques such as mindfulness meditation to treat a range of psychological conditions that conventional psychiatry finds difficult to deal with.

They must be utterly irrational as well.

On the other hand, you could just be spouting ignorant nonsense.

So these dollar grabing teachers lack contenment!!

What the hell are they teaching to others??

It would be different story if they give away to poor or needy section of society all of the donated loot.

So these dollar grabing teachers lack contenment!!

should have been

So these dollar grabing teachers lack contentment!!

If, after examining the available evidence, you believe that something is true then it is rational to accept and act upon that belief, this is true for religious believers, atheists, political activists and all other kinds of people.

You confuse evidence and belief WestRuntonWeasel. Belief actually doesnt need evidence because belief is irrational. Do you think it is also rational, with scant evidence, to believe that someone is guilty of a crime and convict them? Surely, overwhelming evidence is something that would cause someone to accept something as a fact?

The only reason you believe that acceptance of religion is not a rational reaction for many people is that you do not share this belief yourself.

Not sharing a belief doesnt mean that anyone questioning it is wrong though surely? Why is it rational to believe in something with no evidence (or evidence that is at the very best extremely dubious). For instance, the New Testament was cherry picked from many potential books until it was created in its present form. I understand that this took several hundred years and was well after the event.

The very fact that people have different religions, many of them conflicting in quite essential ways, is probably enough to indicate that many millions, if not billions, of people must be wrong in their beliefs. Isnt this evidence enough of at least some of them being irrational?

So these dollar grabing teachersmendicant order lack contenment!!

should have been

So these dollar grabing teachers lack contentment!!

Despite its current hipness Buddhism is just another peasant mentality and vehicle for religious charlatans trying to a make a few quid off the gullible. We need less religion in the world, not more.

Well yes, but the Buddhists … well they have the funkiest stuff though. Incense sticks smell better than other religions, the colours are vivid and their art is so trippy. If you have to have a religion, I can see why people choose this one. Better the clean look of the Buddhists than the look what I ate this week bearded appearance of some of our Anglican brethren!

The very fact that people have different religions, many of them conflicting in quite essential ways, is probably enough to indicate that many millions, if not billions, of people must be wrong in their beliefs. Isnt this evidence enough of at least some of them being irrational?

Whats true for person A may not be true for person B. A great many religious differences are differences of opinion. (Im hard pressed to think of one which isnt.) Take; who is the True Prophet, gold for runescape for example. Its like asking which is the best Pink Floyd album. Quite possible to have many simultaneously correct answers.

It doesnt have any God, and no sin. If you dont want to be a Buddhist, then no ones going to condemn you for it. Its attitude to the concept of morals is about as far from absolute as you can get. It questions the very idea of right and wrong and existence. Buddhisms goals are individual and internal, not external, so theres never (to my knowledge) been a Buddhist war, although bad Buddhists have supported factions is wars, theyve been the exception.

Its completely different from Western religions and more like a philosophy on life to my mind, but Im a bad Buddhist so would recommend further reading rather than taking my word for it. Be ready for some deep, seemingly incomprehensible texts attempting to distill it all. Then of-course theres Zen Buddhism…

Like everything these days, people cant wait to repackage it and flog it, but because its so all encompassing and demanding, taking a lifetime of contemplative thought, they just take little aspects of it and construct something else fit for market that will supposedly take 5 minutes. Youll find it in healing, in all sorts of dodgy massages, in hocus pocus, but IMHO most of those are totally useless rip offs alongside the real thing. A good Buddhist swears a vow pf poverty, not charges by the half hour.

Better to travel well than to arrive. Didnt Buddha say that?

I dont think he meant business class. But then, who am I to interpret his teachings?

Espousing the law of prophets has often involved the lure of profits.

Buddism is just a religion for people who dont want to be seen as religious but rather as-(puke-puke)- spiritual.

I dont think you really understand what Buddhism is. Youve got a sort of tabloid, Christian view of it.

Thats what accountants and investment advisors are for – they handle the vulgar temporal dosh while the spiritual leaders focus on the important metaphysical issues. Not that this is limited to Buddhism, of course.

Ahhh another classic stratergy of Buddhism if you think its tosh it is because you arent granted the neccessary insight to see the truth, Buddhism is to complex for the likes of you doubters.

There are plenty of Buddhist monasteries in the UK offering full meditation instruction where one can go, sometimes up to 12 days and its all free. They get by on donations from former students but there is no obligation to pay.

Its a great shame the teachings arent more readily available to anyone below the middle class. Its also a shame there are so few minorities in the sangha.

When the teachings are treated as a commodity, people tend to think they can acquire them by buying them. Going on lots of courses guarantees no realisation in itself, but it can easily inflate ones self image.

Oh please, people spend their entertainment dollars on whatever amusement attracts them. We flew to New York to see Philip Glass (twice), to DC to see Dawkins, Hitchens, Hirsi Ali, Harris & Dennett, to LA for Bill Maher & Dawkins.

Heck even we just returned from a driving trip across the border to see theSweetback Sisters again and are already booked for Shrewsbury Folk Festival 2012.

I always say no thanks to hockey tickets though.

Making money out of teaching is completely contrary to the spirit of Buddhism. If you are paying for Buddhism,claws of ago. you need your head examined.

At the Buddhist Society in London, non-members can attend the Introductory Course for free. Members get all classes for free, and the teachers are not paid. They will also put you in touch with a local group if you live outside London.

Believe what you want, I really dont mind, but I still dont think you understand it.

Its not too complex for the likes of you doubters, I just doubt youve bothered trying and are resorting to the usual cliches aimed (rightly) at Western religions when it really is a very different proposition.

Despite its current hipness Buddhism is just another peasant mentality and vehicle for religious charlatans trying to a make a few quid off the gullible.

Now that is ignorant. Peasant mentality?. What, like most of the British population? What exactly is a peasant mentality? Most Britons are little more than serfs, but I dont think thats what you mean. Do you know what you mean?

Hipness? In very small circles I suppose youre right, but thats just New Age shit. I

You need to educate yourself.

Looks like Buddhism has become westernised. I wonder what the Siddhartha Gautama would have to say about this. I suspect that like Jesus of Nazareth hed want to expel the moneymakers from the temple!

I would be very careful with anything organised bySogyal Rinpoche. Hes not a stranger to controversy.

Full list of possible controversial teachers and groups to be foundhere.

Gaia House in Devon has a programme of residential courses with visiting teachers, with cost on a sliding scale from 118 to 59 depending on means. Director Andy Power says theres an element of trust involved in this. The fees for a Zen retreat with senior teachers Stephen and Martine Batchelor range from 363 to 76.

You should also point out that these teachings are given freely. Whatever monies go to the teachers on these courses areDna: unsolicited contrbutions which retreatants are free to give, or not, as they see fit. In theory May 2011, teachers like the Batchelors might end up getting nothing for having given a weeks retreat.

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My Irish music group is doing better than ever now, too. I dont think that means were evil.

I have heard that the arts do better during times of financial crisis; I would be interested to see whether this applies to religion, as well. Makes a certain amount of sense to me.

At any rate, its not illegal to raise money. I hope you dont become similarly appalled if the Red Cross manages to raise money despite the climate!

As a fairly long term member – and volunteer – of Rigpa (Sogyal Rinpoches organisation) I can safely say that this article is slightly mischievous, and more than a bit selective with the evidence.

Those fees are correct but dont take into account the fact that the teaching itself is free rift platinum/a> , the fee goes towards the organisation itself and the logistics of a retreat, which are considerable (in the case of Lerab Ling the strength of the Euro doesnt help either). Rigpa has a policy of never turning anyone away for not being able to afford the fees, but students tend to value the teachings very highly and will pay what they can; there are some rich students, there are a lot of poor ones too.